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Thread starter #1

CanuckShooter

Wapiti Killer
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Giscome, BC, well close to there
Unbelievable what just happened on 'hunting bc' facebook page. I can't even express how much it pizzes me off when a mod uses their power to push their own agenda, like the outfitters need protection from my rants.

This is the picture the picture I posted on there, it got a lot of attention. A mod decided he didn't like my post "Can you imagine not having a bull moose LEH and having to pass on this bull so an outfitters client could shot him?"

Thanks for letting me rant, Mike Hoard is a dick as a mod. FYI IMHO

49255512_10157091068692941_7945999096022564864_n.jpg
 
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MID-ISLAND
:Heh, heh, heh:INDEED !!!!! there are hunters and then,there are those in the '' commercial-business'' of hunting............some confuse the two as being one !
 

Buck Naked

Well-Known Member
Messages
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71
I don't get it...whats the connection between not having an leh and a g/o client?
regardless, sux there is censoring, but there is on here too, its everywhere
 

Bow Walker

SHOOTING FOR THE KILL.
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6200 km Away From Home.
I don't get it...whats the connection between not having an leh and a g/o client?
regardless, sux there is censoring, but there is on here too, its everywhere
Sometimes (not always) it is a matter of necessity. Every internet site worth more than a pinch of dirt has to be moderated in some form or another. I do not defend anyone with my comments. My comments are a generalization only.
 

Foxton Gundogs

Admin./ Goose & Prawn Pig ..... Cedar BC
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Cedar
I agree Dan, we would have no members worth their salt if we opened the site up to a no holds barred free-for-all. I think we are one of the least moderated outdoor sites going, just enough to follow the rules and keep things civil is a far cry from "censorship" IMHO.
 

Turnagain

Active Member
Messages
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152
Location
Interior BC
Selective moderation seems to be a hang up on “all” sites called Hunting (in) BC.
I should know...the “Big Tu-tu” has thrown me off enough times when I’ve stepped on one of his Angels toes.
Lol!
By the way CanuckShooter...that’s a really nice rack......on the moose as well.
 

Turnagain

Active Member
Messages
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Location
Interior BC
I don't get it...whats the connection between not having an leh and a g/o client?
You are exactly right in asking....”what’s the connection between not having an LEH and a G/O client?
I’ve got a couple of comments on this since I’m a resident hunter with a bit of a commercial interest.
If an outfitter has a guided client on the ground hunting there is either a LEH or GOS open for BC residents.
As for moose...since CanuckShooter is basing his “story” off of a “nice” moose picture there is also the availability of PTA’s to enable residents to hunt with out of province (and sometimes out of country) friends and family.
NOWHERE IN BC is there a place where guided clients are hunting while BC residents are sidelined.
Looking at the facts, maybe all the mod was doing was throwing out the trash.
 
Thread starter #16

CanuckShooter

Wapiti Killer
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Giscome, BC, well close to there
You are exactly right in asking....”what’s the connection between not having an LEH and a G/O client?
I’ve got a couple of comments on this since I’m a resident hunter with a bit of a commercial interest.
If an outfitter has a guided client on the ground hunting there is either a LEH or GOS open for BC residents.
As for moose...since CanuckShooter is basing his “story” off of a “nice” moose picture there is also the availability of PTA’s to enable residents to hunt with out of province (and sometimes out of country) friends and family.
NOWHERE IN BC is there a place where guided clients are hunting while BC residents are sidelined.
Looking at the facts, maybe all the mod was doing was throwing out the trash.
Actually, just to clarify my statement. In BC we have a general open season for bull moose in some areas, in others we have a general open season for spike/fork [2 point or smaller] and a limited entry draw lottery we can buy a ticket on for any bull moose in those areas. So if you live in Region 7 where I do there is only spike/fork moose hunting unless you win the lottery, while at the same time the local guide outfitters are allocated 25% of the bull moose tags available in the same area. SO what happens is local resident hunters that don't win the lottery [I've won once in the last 22 years] can only hunt spike/fork bull moose and the clients of licensed guide outfitters can shoot the big bull moose up to the allocation limit of the outfitter they hire.

To be quite frank, I have no problem with outfitters and guided hunters AT ALL,. what burns my ass is having to win a big bull moose lottery [like pulling hens teeth] while some wealthy hunter [local or foreign] can just buy the tag off an outfitter. To me it stinks of elitism and shouldn't be allowed. IMHO Edit: And I believe in standing up for what you believe in so I refuse to let go of this beef. ;-)
 

CF8889

Long-Time Member
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Wild Rose Country
I've always thought it was weird that G/O's got tags allocated. You really shouldn't be able to buy a LEH tag just because you have more money then others.

It'd make a lot more sense, that you have to win the tag... then hire a guide (if you want to really increase your odds of a big animal.. or don't have the gear/time to DIY). I realize that would make the outfitters business much more difficult... but personally "making a profit" is not high on my priorities list when I think of hunting.
 

Cedar Cowgirl

Cowgirl Pride.
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158
Location
Cedar B.C.
Gcreek, they have enough "keyboard tough guys" without him. One of the administers is certainly a fine "man" he has been banned from just about every hunting site in BC at one time or another, including this one permanently for attacking members with threats and lies. He attacked me personally calling me things that are totally unfit to print here (or anywhere else) he has threatened to "Spit in my face" in open forum on another site (I would really welcome him to try). With people like that in charge, how can anyone expect a site to be moderated fairly.
 

IronNoggin

Stone Cold
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Port Alberni
... One of the administers is certainly a fine "man" he has been banned from just about every hunting site in BC at one time or another ...
Ahhh Yes. The Spineless Mutt I referred to previously.
Offered to meet up physically and insinuated he was going to kick my ass (on that FB page btw).
Withdrew his offer when the Kechika thread was posted and several of his Fan Boyz suggested he might want to reconsider before an "Old Man" (who was obviously capable of a LOT more backcountry effort than that lardass will ever be) many years his senior totally embarrassed / humiliated him. :highly_amused:

Be interested to see if they ever do approve you gcreek.
Please do let us know...

Cheers,
Nog
 

REMINGTON JIM

Rem M700 XCR 11 375 H&H Shooter
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Reg 3 Kammy
CS says : To be quite frank, I have no problem with outfitters and guided hunters AT ALL,. what burns my ass is having to win a big bull moose lottery [like pulling hens teeth] while some wealthy hunter [local or foreign] can just buy the tag off an outfitter. To me it stinks of elitism and shouldn't be allowed. IMHO Edit: And I believe in standing up for what you believe in so I refuse to let go of this beef. ;-)

Well Heres the way i see it ! I was born and raised in and have always lived - worked and Payed taxes Here in BC It PISSES me off when some one can " BUY " a tag here that i cannot GET to hunt unless i WIN a lottery ! Of any Hunted animals in BC ! All species should be avail to Residents of BC before any :Really Mad:FOREIGNERS get one ! :mad: jmho RJ
 

Foxton Gundogs

Admin./ Goose & Prawn Pig ..... Cedar BC
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BN we tried that route and where did it get us, like Merv says time to unite against a common enemy. G-bears are just the start if we don't stand together and stand firm.
 

Turnagain

Active Member
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Interior BC
BN we tried that route and where did it get us......
All that little fiasco did was divide hunters and open us up to be prey for politicians and the anti movement.
Sure is funny that the clowns at the source of the past allocation (--)storm wrapped their arms around Raincoast and the likes only a few short years later.
RJ & BN.....where do you guys stand....with the antis trying to drag hunting a little deeper in the dirt?
There are better ways to improve the big picture than fighting over scraps like a pack of cur mutts.
 

Piperdown

Well-Known Member
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Jordan River
No not on much, not posting much, thought i would give you a break :Oh Yeah!: Hey were is Brvalley haven't seen him around, hope everything is ok with him??
 
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REMINGTON JIM

Rem M700 XCR 11 375 H&H Shooter
Messages
5,116
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151
Location
Reg 3 Kammy
All that little fiasco did was divide hunters and open us up to be prey for politicians and the anti movement.
Sure is funny that the clowns at the source of the past allocation (--)storm wrapped their arms around Raincoast and the likes only a few short years later.
RJ & BN.....where do you guys stand....with the antis trying to drag hunting a little deeper in the dirt?
There are better ways to improve the big picture than fighting over scraps like a pack of cur mutts.
Let me Make this PERFECTLY CLEAR Pal ! I hate the Antis - i Hate all The LEFTest parties - I want a G Bear HUNT back and i want to be first on the LIST over top of all FNs and GOs ! Is that CLEAR enought for you ! :Yikes!: RJ
 

Turnagain

Active Member
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Interior BC
Let me Make this PERFECTLY CLEAR Pal ! I hate the Antis - i Hate all The LEFTest parties - I want a G Bear HUNT back and i want to be first on the LIST over top of all FNs and GOs ! Is that CLEAR enought for you ! :Yikes!: RJ
Loud and clear RJ.
Just like a kid reaching his hand in to grab a fist full out of the cookie jar....zero thought for the consequences other than making sure that the rightful share is achieved.
Most of us have grown past the stage of fighting over scraps and some are working their butts off to see to it we have something around to hunt down the road.
How about you....are you personally doing anything towards this.
I’m not a guy that buys into the garbage peddled about local clubs and the cherished Fed doing much good at dragging wildlife populations out of the sinkhole most of this provinces ungulates is in.
The old spiel of maximum opportunity, unhindered access and its my right to take what’s mine has helped get us where we are.
I’m finding many of the loudest squawkers really aren’t real serious conservationist/ outdoorsman or hunters anyhow...,more tend to be disgruntled/ misinformed bellyachers.
 
Thread starter #38
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Giscome, BC, well close to there
All that little fiasco did was divide hunters and open us up to be prey for politicians and the anti movement.
Sure is funny that the clowns at the source of the past allocation (--)storm wrapped their arms around Raincoast and the likes only a few short years later.
RJ & BN.....where do you guys stand....with the antis trying to drag hunting a little deeper in the dirt?
There are better ways to improve the big picture than fighting over scraps like a pack of cur mutts.
How do you see it dividing hunters? I'd say more accurately was it divided hunters and business people. It's just too bad those duds that wrapped their arms around RainForest didn't manage to get a more equitable allocation deal for resident hunters. Seems to me, from memory, the pres had family in the outfitting business so perhaps that had some bearing on where things ended up?
 

Foxton Gundogs

Admin./ Goose & Prawn Pig ..... Cedar BC
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OK people, anyone who knows me knows I was in the front lines of the Allocation Dispute. I was as involved with the Resident Hunters and BCWF as anyone, so with that in mind I believe I have a good insight as to what went on, why it went on and how it went on. Here are the facts as I know them.
Guides have been around for ever, I guided in the late 60s, there was very little animosity between the Guides and Resident Hunters then. We hunted the same areas and got along and even helped each other out at times. It was not until certain members of the GOABC and the BCWF executive decided they would use "us" to achieve their underlying agenda. The Government jumped on the band wagon and played both ends against the middle for their purposes, and we(me included) bought into it. Sure we would all like more that's human nature but what do the foreign hunters have that we don't. Sure they can hire a guide and pay for being able to hunt, but that's it. What do we have that the foreigners don't. We have GOS on most species, we have LEH lottery that gives us more opportunities and if we so desire(and can afford it) we can hire the same guides and hunt the same animals in the same places as those so called "privileged" foreign hunters do. With that in mind we have the scales weighted in our favor. The argument that the GOs are only interested in money is a weak one. Sure they want all the money from their business venture they can get the same as we all do, but they don't care if their clients are Foreigners or Canadian or BC Residents.
I will go on record as saying I am 100% opposed to foreign ownership of guide and outfitting business. They have been traditionally owned and operated by resident ranchers, homesteaders trappers etc to supplement their incomes. They should still be Resident owned. Guides and assistants should be BC Residents that in my mind is non negotiable.
It is time to kick the bureaucrats in the BCWF, GOABC, and the Government to the curb and roll up our sleeves as hunters, outdoors people and BC Guides and work out a solution that is fair for all and stand together to achieve it. We are not each other's enemies and only we can stop the hidden agendas of the bureaucrats that have pitted us against each other. Either we learn from our past mistakes or we are doomed and so is hunting of any kind in this Great Province.
 
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OK people, anyone who knows me knows I was in the front lines of the Allocation Dispute...
I was right there beside you Buddy.
And I agree with everything you posted. :Oh Yeah!:
We got played.
And we are still being played.
Time to either accept that, or start to turn it around - together that is.

Cheers,
Matt
 
Thread starter #46
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Giscome, BC, well close to there
i was their also...and i do think we need to move on....BUT I DO NOT HAVE TO LIKE G Os
My issue isn't the guide outfitters, it's the LEH system itself that in many ways benefits the outfitters. I think that if there is a need for an LEH hunt that BC Residents should get first priority over non residents. AT the very least foreign hunters should have to win an LEH in the lottery in the same way we do, fair is fair. IF they don't have any success like I do with my bull moose applications well too fricking bad, it's a lottery. They could still hire guides and hunt openings that are under GOS like we have been doing since what 1982?? Everyone seems it good enough to tell resident hunters to quit bitching because we can still hunt GOS...well turn it around and lets see how it goes over. A wealthy German hunter can still hunt black bears, wolves, coyotes, mule deer, whitetail deer, elk, caribou, goats and the practically impossible to find spike fork bull moose....you get the idea, there are still plenty of opportunities for them and the outfitters without them having exclusive access to so much of the allocations.
 
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Interior BC
My issue isn't the guide outfitters, it's the LEH system itself that in many ways benefits the outfitters. I think that if there is a need for an LEH hunt that BC Residents should get first priority over non residents. AT the very least foreign hunters should have to win an LEH in the lottery in the same way we do, fair is fair. IF they don't have any success like I do with my bull moose applications well too fricking bad, it's a lottery. They could still hire guides and hunt openings that are under GOS like we have been doing since what 1982?? Everyone seems it good enough to tell resident hunters to quit bitching because we can still hunt GOS...well turn it around and lets see how it goes over. A wealthy German hunter can still hunt black bears, wolves, coyotes, mule deer, whitetail deer, elk, caribou, goats and the practically impossible to find spike fork bull moose....you get the idea, there are still plenty of opportunities for them and the outfitters without them having exclusive access to so much of the allocations.
Let’s take this a bit farther.....where I’m under quota to guide clients but all of us resident hunters can hunt a GOS do you think we can even it up and throw the quota system out.
GOS for all!
I’m only joking....but that said I bet a lot of guys don’t really understand the allocation/quota system we have in place ... all they really have is what/how they have been programmed to think.
BC is still tops in hunting opportunities for all of us...I realize we’ve reached a low in ungulate numbers due to the predation pit we’re in but that can turn around.
Too bad the Fed didn’t rev everyone up on wildlife and predator management instead of teaching their followers to scrap over bones.
 
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Langley BC
Is not the first time Guides bullied their way, through mods or fake posts in the other site CS.Not all outfitters are bad people(!!!????).But they think they own the wildlife and we are trespassers.
Reading the BC Rams book, about Gary Vince you can see how he felt about you as resident hunter.
And not only him,Skook and Cook were right up there with their feelings/hate.
On the allocation issue we got to see our real friends, be it GOABC or Liberal ministers.
Selfishness is on all sides, some more than others.
Guides were setting themselves to benefit out of the "New BC" as the politicians plan to create.
FN first....GOABC second and us a very distant third.
BCWF did nothing(!!!!!) and now we got people saying "lets fight our common enemy".....can someone define "common enemy"????
Antis were our enemy for ever, in our last fight GOABC ....was your friend?????????
Well my definition of "Friend " differs!!!!!
 
Messages
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Interior BC
Is not the first time Guides bullied their way, through mods or fake posts in the other site CS.Not all outfitters are bad people(!!!????).But they think they own the wildlife and we are trespassers.
Reading the BC Rams book, about Gary Vince you can see how he felt about you as resident hunter.
And not only him,Skook and Cook were right up there with their feelings/hate.
On the allocation issue we got to see our real friends, be it GOABC or Liberal ministers.
Selfishness is on all sides, some more than others.
Guides were setting themselves to benefit out of the "New BC" as the politicians plan to create.
FN first....GOABC second and us a very distant third.
BCWF did nothing(!!!!!) and now we got people saying "lets fight our common enemy".....can someone define "common enemy"????
Antis were our enemy for ever, in our last fight GOABC ....was your friend?????????
Well my definition of "Friend " differs!!!!!
Maybe guides should lobby FN’s to get back the commercial grizzly hunt?
It seems that a lot of residents don’t seem to support science based wildlife decisions.
FN’s and guides get it that an increase in grizzlies will have an impact on ungulate numbers....the hunt was said to be scientifically justified by our governments best bear biologists.
Nobody is bullying anyone into this Apolonius.....if the BCWF doesn’t have the balls to fight for who they are supposed to represent...well I guess that’s the way it goes.
When the BCWF accepted money from the Moore Foundation and Tides the writing was on the wall.
Once the fed started lining their pockets with anti money it was plain and simple where they were going....it only got more obvious when one of the BCWF’s paid employees wrote Mr Weaver’s wildlife mandate that was passed on to the NDP to adopt.
Apolonius....you got way bigger problems than guides.
 

Foxton Gundogs

Admin./ Goose & Prawn Pig ..... Cedar BC
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APPY, the Mods here do not give in to bullying(I can't speak for other sites). This Mod has formed his opinions from the inside of the Allocation Issues on out. Right now everyone's Problem is the Current Government, the BCWF's refusal to stand up for its Founding Base, hunters, preferring to look to the antis(Raincoast) for support and the fact we have no Provincial Hunter/Angler's Association. We need to get things like access and the G-bear problems taken care of, then we can address problems with Guides and Indians IF they need to be addressed. You are entitled to your opinion. one big step is to either turn the BCWF back to it' roots or get an organization that is by and for hunters, anglers and shooters. I do not have lot of faith in the first option.
 
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